Combatting drift

[Steve Baker]

I'm not sure if I'm putting this in the right place. Please feel free to move this post Charles, if I have put it here in error. My question is related to operating a Steadicam, so that is why I put it here.

But first, I feel compelled to let you all know I am by no means a professional. On the extreme contrary, I'm  a simple hobby-ist, who just likes making fun films with my kids and friends, when able. I like learning new things, and when I stumbled upon this forum, and saw the steadicams some of you have built with great skill, and saw the opportunity to learn to build a Steadicam, (and potentially end up with nicer, smoother footage than I could otherwise get), I jumped at the chance and bought Cody's Low Budget book. I have spent the past 6 months or so working on it, and after much trial and error, it is nearing completion. (Though, much like the fact that I am not a professional film maker or Steadicam operator, I am also not a professional machinist either. )

I put it on for the first time yesterday, and ran around the house, ..but a problem I am having is with excessive drift. The bearing I have is beautiful (thanks to David Holmes generosity), but I find when I move from one room to the next, as I round the corner, the camera wants to stay the way it was aimed (Newton's law obviously), but the further I get around the corner it then starts turning such that once I am around the corner, it is well into a spin and then continues to rotate past where I want it. I don't know if I am explaining this well enough, it's hard to explain. But I am wondering,  what is the general way of dealing with that? Do you keep a few fingers on the post near the gimbal, and "guide" it in the direction you want it facing, while carefully trying not to affect the balance of the sled?   Or is there some trick I am unaware of? Or could it be that I may not be balanced correctly that is causing it? Any suggestions? Or can anyone explain to me how the pros deal with this? Thanks for the input. I have another question regarding balancing, but I'll wait until this has been dealt with.

Thanks everybody! I am truly grateful to you all for past input and help. This place is a great place to learn, filled with very talented, capable, helpful and kind-hearted people. I am humbled and feel that my being here probably brings the overall quality down,  but I am truly interested, genuine and eager to learn, and thankful.

Steve

[Tom Frisch]

I'm a complete beginner as well, so take this with the appropriate grains of salt.
While operating, you keep one hand on the gimbal (the knurled part below the actual bearing)
, and one on the gimbal handle (the part that connects gimbal to end of the arm).  You are meant
to keep the gimbal hand a very light touch.  This is the hand that you use to counter the forces
that come up when you change directions.  I think that is what you need to work on.

I promised myself that IF I'm able to successfully build my own steadicam, that I'll reward myself
with one of the operator workshops, so I can learn how to fly it.  Maybe I'll see you at one in a
year or so (at the rate I'm going!)

-Tom

[Steve Baker]

Thanks for the reply Tom! That's kinda what I figured it would be, ..along those lines, though I wasn't aware of holding it below the gimbal. I will try that next. I tried holding it lightly above the gimbal. But I get a lot of sway, so I am definitely affecting the whole thing by doing so. But with all of 10 minutes of experience, EVER, with a Steadicam. I have a lot to learn, and will need lots and lots of practice. But my first 10 minutes of footage is rather humiliatingly bad. And the doorframes to my living room are now nicked by the arm,.. my wife is less than impressed.   

I am up in Ontario, Canada, and am completely unaware of anything in regards to Steadicam workshops. Not to mention the fact that I don't think I could afford (or justify the expense of) one, for a hobbyist. But yes, it would be the best thing for learning the tricks of the trade. I'll keep it in mind though for the future.

And, right now we are buried in snowfall, (a record year thus far) and the outside temperature is -12 Celsius (not sure what that is in Fahrenheit). I'd love to go outside and learn, but the majority of my testing will probably have to wait until spring. Thanks again Tom!

Any one with far more experience than we have want to put in their 2 cents?
Steve

[Phil Kindred]

Your best bet is to buy the EFP DVD--it explains cornering and finger placement on the gimbal.  Practice and proper balance of the rig will make a big difference.   

[Charles King]

Your best bet is to buy the EFP DVD--it explains cornering and finger placement on the gimbal. Practice and proper balance of the rig will make a big difference.

...and you can also get Terry's DVD, with Cody as the guest star. The characteristic of Terry's arm is the same as cody's Phase I arm and might help in this situation. Both DVD's would be a nice addition to your collection.

[Vladimir Korshunov]

I'm not sure if I'm putting this in the right place. Please feel free to move this post Charles, if I have put it here in error. My question is related to operating a Steadicam, so that is why I put it here.

But first, I feel compelled to let you all know I am by no means a professional. On the extreme contrary, I'm  a simple hobby-ist, who just likes making fun films with my kids and friends, when able. I like learning new things, and when I stumbled upon this forum, and saw the steadicams some of you have built with great skill, and saw the opportunity to learn to build a Steadicam, (and potentially end up with nicer, smoother footage than I could otherwise get), I jumped at the chance and bought Cody's Low Budget book. I have spent the past 6 months or so working on it, and after much trial and error, it is nearing completion. (Though, much like the fact that I am not a professional film maker or Steadicam operator, I am also not a professional machinist either. )

I put it on for the first time yesterday, and ran around the house, ..but a problem I am having is with excessive drift. The bearing I have is beautiful (thanks to David Holmes generosity), but I find when I move from one room to the next, as I round the corner, the camera wants to stay the way it was aimed (Newton's law obviously), but the further I get around the corner it then starts turning such that once I am around the corner, it is well into a spin and then continues to rotate past where I want it. I don't know if I am explaining this well enough, it's hard to explain. But I am wondering,  what is the general way of dealing with that? Do you keep a few fingers on the post near the gimbal, and "guide" it in the direction you want it facing, while carefully trying not to affect the balance of the sled?   Or is there some trick I am unaware of? Or could it be that I may not be balanced correctly that is causing it? Any suggestions? Or can anyone explain to me how the pros deal with this? Thanks for the input. I have another question regarding balancing, but I'll wait until this has been dealt with.

Thanks everybody! I am truly grateful to you all for past input and help. This place is a great place to learn, filled with very talented, capable, helpful and kind-hearted people. I am humbled and feel that my being here probably brings the overall quality down,  but I am truly interested, genuine and eager to learn, and thankful.

Steve

Haj Steve, nice to meet You here. Professionally I am on the same boat: hobby that more than hobby .
 HBS is the great soars of inspiration; more: it is the bunch of people who can and do a lot... very kind people  
About Your question: did You read about static and dynamic balance? Very first thing is to check the drop time (1,5-2 sec). I do recommend to go through manuals and some videos from Youtube, there is simple and enlighten demo on the  "Artemis","Slideman" site, some on VIMEO... The best (IMHO) was from "Tiffen", clear and simple.

Vladimir

[Charles King]

To make it easier for finding the topics Vladimir mentioned is to just check out the HBS 101 forum.

[Steve Baker]

Thanks for all the responses!

Charles and Phil, the DVD's sound like a great idea. Can you point me to where I might find them (both the EFP and the Terry's)? I'd love to look those up and see what they are.

Vladimir, yes I have read through the Dynamic balance articles and many, many posts on this site. Very enlightening. I am getting pretty close to dynamic balance, but am having difficulty telling if some of the sway I am getting is from me (in the act of spinning the post), or if it is something else. There are certainly a number of things on it I would like to re-do, and will at some point, as I think they may be a bit off. Like I said, my machining skills (and the equipment I have available to me) are less than stellar. Thanks for the Youtube suggestion, I hadn't thought of that. I'll have a look there as well.

I discovered I underestimated the weight of my sled, and got inadequate springs too. I do not have a precision acurate scale, but on my bathroom scale my sled, with my Canon XH-A1, my "monitor" and counter-weight, is sitting at around 20 pounds. I estimated more like around 15 pounds (my XHA1 weighs 4.5 lbs, so I figured with it's battery, tape and microphone, probably 5 - 6 lbs, and then assuming I would need the same (5 - 6 lbs) counter-weight on the bottom, and then the sled weight guessed at 4 - 5lbs). So I ordered the size/specs of springs Cody's book suggested for 12 - 16 pounds. But now that I have discovered it is more in the 20 pound range, I am going to have to get different springs.

But I digress. I'll save my balancing questions for a separate post. 

[Phil Kindred]

You can get the EFP DVD directly from Tiffen and the Indicam DVD from their website.  Both will be a great help to you.

[Steve Baker]

Thanks,.. I'll look into it!