AVIATOR- new from varizoom

[Joe Sanders]

I totally agree, competition is great. - but a flooded market damages everyone.
Back when there where just a few stabilizer manufactureres thre was a choice for everyone, and for some even GC is the choice (happy now Job?).
Today it just seems that everone want s apeiece of the cake, and there are too many rigs out there. Take Sachtler as an example (and nothing more) They make excelt tripods, and kick ass pedestalls (I work with both) .. But why did they make Stabilizer? Why not just stick with what they are good at?
Varizoom has the Flowpod, inovative, clever, cool.. But do they need to offer all the same stuff that eveyone else is too?
Lada makes a car that is about the most reliable car in winter conditions. They coudl make a SUV, or a sports car, but what's the point, they have soemthign great, why spoil it?
Glidecam makes cheap stabilizers, for the most part that's what they do (ok, so they have a jib too.. again, why?) and they are getting prety darn good at it to. Good for them for stickign with their product and striving to make it better. From the V16 "it does everything a real steadicam does, just as well, but for less" BS, to the V25, they have come a long way.

I'm not going to bother arguing over who is better and why (we all know.. it's the rig that works for you)
I'm just saying that there's a lot of rigs our there that really are nothing more than a copycat that does nothing to improve the product, but to saturate the market, hurting manufacturers and operators alike.

 - Mikko

I have to disagree with you on a couple of points Mikko,

As most of you know I don’t really know much about Steadi-rigs. Other than how they work. But I do know a little about business.

A flooded market is not actually bad for the consumer, whether professional or high end prosumer. It simply means they have more choices. Now you could interpret this as being bad for the professional rig operator because everyone with a couple of thousand dollars is now a rig operator. That scenario is prevalent in all professions where the original guys got paid a lot of money to do their work.  You have to look back at what they had to do to get floating shots in 1977.  They didn’t have hot heads or digital video cameras so they rented a Chapman dolly and a LARGE crane.  Altogether thousands per day. Along comes a guy that can do a big chunk of it for say $500 a day or even $1500 a day. Either way still big savings.

So this continues along for 17 years (patents used to last 17 years) all of a sudden the market starts to grow and everyone finds out it aint rocket science it’s just a pretty nice piece of equipment. Think of the difference in technology and materials for a $30K car compared to a $30K rig. Billions of dollars and a hundred years time millions of people, went into developing cars

This applies to cameras and almost all of the equipment in the motion picture industry.

The next point:

There are several reasons why companies expand into other markets, the first and foremost money.  They are able to use their goodwill (existing customer base) to lower their marketing cost. Take Sachtler for instance. They already have the machining capability and the loyal customer base. It’s a natural fit.

And lastly:

A flooded market will result eventually in a shake out. Where the companies that do the best job overall, will prevail. That doesn’t necessarily mean that the company that makes the best rig will win, it means that the companies that sell the rigs with the best value will most likely prevail.

Just a thought.

[Tom Wills]

The only problem with a flooded market is when some competitors try to make sub-standard products look like they're made from 24 carat gold.

[Trevor Crump]

The only problem with a flooded market is when some competitors try to make sub-standard products look like they're made from 24 carat gold.

This will happen regardles of how many in the market place. but with groups like this, and testers like charles, the poorer (quality) rigs are identfied.

[Joe Sanders]

Caveat Emptor, I guess.

Ay Tom?

[Tom Wills]

Yep. I like how much VALID competiton in the world of Stabilizers there is though. So many manufacturers out there are making good products, that although the market is flooded wich el-cheapo rigs that break your wrist, there are quite a few out there really worth it. Magiqcam, IndiCam, Glidecam, and ActionCam come to mind.

[Charles King]

You know what. We can go on and on and on, but the point is, not everybody can afford the steadicam rig or any high profile system for that matter. As I said before, if I could afford it, this forum and the HBS website might not have been. It all depends on one important factor. How serious is the individual? What is end user market like? If it is just small coporate or wedding videos then the steadicam system is way, way outta the need for the kind of work that these jobs entail.

If I was going into coporate then naturally I would choose something within the scale budget and the needs that would fit just my line of work.

So the need for the market can be to sound over rated, but that over rated stigma comes to play when the need to buy a stabilizer comes into light. So again, we can go on and on debating but if you don't have the budget to buy a high profile rig, then you tend to gear towards something that comes close. That's all it is folks. 

[Leigh Wanstead]

Frankly speaking, there is no way for me to pay a US$66,000 rig or US$20,000 or US$10,000 arm even I have the money now. I spent US$66,000 or more to develop my stabilizer. I realized that stabilizer manufacture business is quite expensive to enjoy.

Regards
Leigh

You know what. We can go on and on and on, but the point is, not everybody can afford the steadicam rig or any high profile system for that matter. As I said before, if I could afford it, this forum and the HBS website might not have been. It all depends on one important factor. How serious is the individual? What is end user market like? If it is just small coporate or wedding videos then the steadicam system is way, way outta the need for the kind of work that these jobs entail.

If I was going into coporate then naturally I would choose something within the scale budget and the needs that would fit just my line of work.

So the need for the market can be to sound over rated, but that over rated stigma comes to play when the need to buy a stabilizer comes into light. So again, we can go on and on debating but if you don't have the budget to buy a high profile rig, then you tend to gear towards something that comes close. That's all it is folks. 

[MikkoWilson]

Come on Leigh, when do we get to see your rig?

- Mikko

[Leigh Wanstead]

Come on Leigh, when do we get to see your rig?

 - Mikko

Soon

Regards
Leigh

[constantine tirint]

Everyone pays that he can afford to pay.
But please do not make statements about products you dont know.Glidecam gold is a very good rig and does what is suppose to do very well.Actioncam has come up with a tremendues arm and a very nice and simple rig.
Apart of that its one of the companies that always find its own way to do things and dont copy.
The arm is original.The vest is wide adjustable.The sled is super simple. The quality top,the price very logical.
Putting Glidecam and Actioncam next to companies like magicam and varizoom and what ever else is only showing complete ignorence in the world of stabilizers.
But I will say this once more.
You can do very nice shots with low end or even a homebuild rig that you made in your garage.
If you practice a lot you can pass all the difficulties it gives you.
You can also buy a high end rig and make really bad shoots.I would name some but thats bad for bussiness.
Buy or build what you can afford and work as much as you can with this tool.You will get there eventually.
After all if you learn with a low end rig, and you become good op, then when yiou buy something better you will be even better.
Ive done that ,Ive been there, and it makes a lot of sense.
Job dont worry,you know the trooth,and your tool is as good as it can be.So your work with it.
Job is an op so AmI and what we state here is nothing to do with advertising tools, its just experience and try to be helpfull.
No I dont own a high end rig I mostly rent MKV and 3a as I dont consider sk2 a high end rig, but Ive done some very nice shoots with it.
Oh and Sachtler is a nice rig too not very original but does the job good.
Just a matter of personal taste.
Constantine

[Leigh Wanstead]

Hi constantine,

Can you clarify what is low end, high end rig in your post?

Regards
Leigh

[constantine tirint]

Oh man do i have to wtite down all these rigs?
I think you know have a look at the commercial rigs.
What would I prefer?
an xcs sled with the allien on board + pro-G7O arm+walter vest+so many thousands of goodos
Come on now...

Is your rig that you build any close to that?
Is it closser to glidecam or sachtler or action cam?
Or close to older rigs like 3a?
Thats the lowest you can go for the money you claim you are spending to build, if thats what you want to know.
and if you are spending that much you should already know before whitch are the best tools out there.

Ihope you know what you are doing, good luck.
Constantine

[Tom Wills]

I hope that that "shows great ignorance" comment wasn't directed towards me. I wasn't putting them in all the same class, by no means, but I was just saying that those rigs all seem to be valid competition. The Magiqcam rig is about comparible with the Glidecam V series. The Actioncam, Glidecam Gold, and the top video Steadicam rigs are all in the same breed. Other companies make things comparible to most of the other Steadicam rigs.

If you weren't meaning that, then just let me know, I just don't want to have people thinking the wrong things about my post.

[Joe Sanders]

Hey Tom,
I wouldn’t worry if I were you, we all read the same post.

Everyone knows, I show great ignorance, pretty much all the time.

[constantine tirint]

I was answering to Leigh Tom thats why what I wrote is under his post, and refering to the 66.000 dollars he is aiming to spent on a homebuild.Read more carefully next time you always seem to be so touchy about things.
The trooth is that sometimes you write more than you have experience on , but its ok as long as you listen and learn nothing wrong about that.
As for Leigh it would be ok to spent that amount if he wanted to go commercial and make a good product, he would propably had to spent even more, but just for hobby unless you are super rich and stabilizer maniac,I wouldnt do it. I would buy an action cam and go snowboarding with my girl for a.......year then surfing for another one.
No offence though thats just me.
Do your thing and do it good.
Constantine